Hamjatta,

You see your own contradictions,you are an internationalist but as far as
Marx is concern he is a racist.However I will not duel on this,because I
have dealt with this issue here sometime back proving that it is nothing but
a big lie to say that Marx is a racist by letting the Man  speak for him
self,if you want to know more about that you can just visit the achieves.
I can see that you have not much again for Fidel,you must have discovered
that the friendship between Fidel and AJJ is based on the fact that there
areCuban doctors in the Gambia,even though Cuban volunteers could be found
in many countries around the world and the other side of the truth is that
it was America and her Western allies who created AJJ,they trained him and
gave him arms and ammunitions and not only that they created the NIA,who
were trained by the CIA,perhaps you did not know that too,the torturing
machines they are using are not from Cuba and it is not Cuba that
re-established military relationship with Gambia,it was the UK and it was
not Cuba that sent military vehicles to the Gambia it was France.The reason
why one sometimes insist that the only time history is important is when we
make analysis with the intention of moving forward and not stagnating or
moving backward.The people of Cuba will deal with Fidel when ever they don't
need him,it will take them a matter of hours to do so even though it has
taking America more that 30 years and stil could not do awayv with him.
Don't mind much,I don't think that way,a critic of my ideas will only make
me open my eyes wider but not to take it as a personal attack.
The issue of the environment was a very very important thing to discuss even
though we have different  opinion on it,this I will take up under a better
heading.No one should be more concern with the environment than Gambians,not
only that we are still not sure for how long Banjul will survive but  that
the destruction have started long ago.Whiles reading, you should be very
much aware that we have seen false environmental  research and reports in
the interest of "Profit"that are bend on confusing efforts towards a better
environment.Capitalism have existed long enough to tell us that we need a
better political system.Can you please check this out,how many nations have
been industrialised since Adam Smith published  " The Wealth of  Nations "
in 1776,remember this was the same year we saw the birth of America as a
Nation.It will be interesting to see that statistics.


For Freedom
Saiks
----- Original Message -----
From: Hamjatta Kanteh <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, July 12, 2001 8:38 PM
Subject: Re: World Bank President Praises Cuba


> Saiks,
>
> Your last correspondence was very revealing. If ever there was a need for
a
> denuder to the contempt in which you hold capitalism and the American
> political system, that correspondence aptly fills the role. I read with
keen
> interest your risible attempts to pigeon-hole the recent racial riots of
> Northern English towns and cities into this bizarre idea of capitalism as
> system intended solely for the exploitation of the human race. This is as
> risible as they come. Saiks, what is currently happening in the North of
> England is not reducible to the simplistic caricature of capitalist fat
cats
> in their drive for ever more profits have dehumanised the North to point
> where it had pitted the different communities and races against each
other.
> These riots are far too complex to be explained away by the simplistic
> explanations that you have suggested. What is unravelling in the North of
> England is not as black and white as the media continues to portray it.
There
> are too many social, political and economic forces at play here for us to
> settle for a simplistic linear narrative of what is happening in English
> Northern cities and towns. I wish i had the time to delve more into this
> issue and give you a proper liberal perspective of what is happening in
the
> North of England.
>
> Similarly, your attempts to correlate the global reaches of capitalism
with
> both current climate changes and the lack of commitment on the Kyoto
treaty
> by some Western countries - notably the US - is another classic leftist
> demonology of the capitalist order. If i understand you correctly now,
every
> living hell on earth - from the AIDS epidemic to the Middle East
conflict -
> is a by-product of the consequences of capitalism. Not even that old
> incendiary, Karl Marx, would be this outrageous! I will not even attempt
to
> debunk this bizarre and risible theory of yours. Meanwhile, i will just
say
> that my own position in the environmental debates is a sceptical one: to
what
> extent has left-wing scaremongering and aversion to capitalism been
factored
> into environmental debates and treaties like Kyoto and what has historical
> antecedents got to say about where we are now and how we got here? To
> understand where i'm coming from, i strongly recommend you read to a
Danish
> scholar and former Greenpeace member, Bjorn Lomberg's - who is not only a
> socialist but also an environmental activist of clear distinction; a clear
> demonstration of my open-minded approach to life, if any were ever
needed -
> excellent book, "The Skeptical Environmentalist". Saiks, even informed
> academics, policy makers and environmental specialists are as split about
> climate and environmental changes as they are about just everything. There
is
> no simple answer to the question: why are we experiencing the climate
changes
> we are currently experiencing? Nor are the solutions as simple and
straight
> forward as you seem to imagine. In short, whilst i'm not in principle
opposed
> to the Kyoto treaty, i'm sceptical about its effective-ness vis-a-vis
> tempering climate and environmental changes and whether it will not in the
> long run end up adversely affecting "developing countries" more than
> "developed countries" in terms of proving to be economically constrictive
and
> eventually restricting the economic growth of the former? As the
> international indignation and hysteria that greeted America's refusal to
> ratify or abide by the Kyoto treaty begins to subside, credible and
> alternative policy options to the Kyoto treaty are beginning to emerge out
of
> the woodwork and getting rather good receptions in hitherto hostile
> audiences. This is one of the ways forward. What will, however, not
generate
> serious and effective policy debates on the environment and climate
changes
> is to let the debate feed on rabid anti- corporate and globalisation
> frenzy.Debate on the environment and climate changes ought to be rescued
from
> this deplorable situation.
>
> I was, again, dismayed to see you snort with derison at my suggestion for
you
> to read actual capitalist texts by capitalist writers like Cobden, Dicey,
> Friedman, Hayek, Mises and Smith instead of  merely depending on left-wing
> interpretations of their works in order for you to understand what
> capitalists actually believe in. If your derisory remarks are anything to
go
> by, your low opinion of these illustrious defenders of human freedom and
> classical liberal tenets expressly demonstrates another high tide of your
> aversion to capitalist opinion and basic tenets. Let me make a brief
> commentary on, say, Cobden's illustrious and noble campaigns for human
> freedom in 19th. century England and beyond and the point would become
> clearer. Cobden was, above all, a free trade classical liberal who
strongly
> believed that through free trade, the world would eventually be free of
> prejudice, bigotry and senseless wars. An avowed pacifist, Cobden was
always
> up in arms against any attempts by the British gov't of Lord Palmerston to
> fight any foreign wars. Invariably, his pacifism is at times at the
expense
> of being at the butt-end of both public ridicule, hostility and
alienation.
> Most importantly, Cobden was the prime mover and originator of such
> progressive and pro- poor movements like the Anti Corn Law League which
> successfully campaigned for an end to that economically restrictive piece
of
> legislation and the disastrous effects it had on the poor of the day. In
the
> process, Cobden was able to garner the support and admiration of such
> Victorian titans like Gladstone and Peel and in extension won them over to
> the cause of free trade. The most remarkable achievement of Cobden's
eventful
> life, however, was his resolute opposition to slavery and imperialism; and
> how his noble collaborations with American abolitionists like Charles
Sumner
> was effective in winning political opinion in England to the side of the
> abolitionists during the American civil war. Cobden, therefore, is a
vintage
> classical liberal activist at work. Let us contrast this with Karl Marx's
> actual achievements for similar convictions. First, Marx was an
incorrigible
> and despicable racist and sexist creep who has for the record stated his
very
> low opinions of blacks and women, calling the former "a sub-human race".
> Second, whilst the likes of Cobden were busy waxing indignant on the moral
> wrongs of slavery and calling for its abolition, Marx was at some point
> opposed to the abolition of slavery in America on the specious grounds
that
> it will hinder the progress of poor white Americans from their working
class
> status to a proletarian one without which the revolution he had predicted
> will never come to be and capitalism will remain the order of the day. I
> wonder whether you will still call yourself a Marxist - after someone who
> opposed the abolition of slavery for sometime and held very low opinions
of
> blacks and women - now you know his racist and sexist convictions. Be that
as
> it may, i've never let this discovery of Marx's nauseating racist and
sexist
> bigotry stop me from reading what he ACTUALLY wrote and believed in. I
> believe a similar open-minded spirit is what will help you understand
where
> capitalists are coming from. That was the point i was always making.
>
> Having said all that, i think we have reached the point in this debate
where
> it would be far more judicious to respectfully agree to disagree and move
on
> to other topical issues. I don't ever think you and i will see eye to eye
on
> the issue of the virtues of capitalism. Saiks, i'm a strong adherent of
> bourgeoisie liberties, moderation and civilisation as the only way to make
> society wholesome, stable and progressive. Having said that, i'm also
> cognisant of the fact that bourgeoisie political, social and economic
orders
> have their limits and will never ever be perfected. Whilst i make no
> apologies for this position, i'm always ready to acknowledge any
shortcomings
> associated with such an order. As i always keep saying to anyone who would
> listen to me, i have an open-mind approach to life and i'm not a
determinist.
> Where evidence decisively repudiates a philosophical position, i adjust
> appropriately and not just according to passing fads or trendy positions;
but
> according to the weight of evidence. Saiks, my blood maybe very African
but
> like Ben Okri, my heart is very universal. My allegiances and sympathies
are
> simply not delineated by my African heritage. I'm an individual first and
> foremost and an African second. Hence for me, ideas and values are not
simply
> bracketed into Asian, African, Western and Eastern values and ideas. Ideas
> and values for me are ultimately universal and each idea and value ought
to
> be judged on their merit and not on their port of origin. As such, i
wholly
> repudiate the notion that ideas and value systems like liberalism and
> capitalism are intrinsically Western and have no place on the African
> continent. Both capitalism and liberalism are all part of that common
human
> genesis, development and history. Anything contrary to this, is a gross
> misapprehension of the evolution of human existence. I hope i have made my
> position clearer.
>
> Finally, I look forward to your insightful and valuable contributions on
> other socio-economic and political issues affecting our peoples. If
anything
> personally offensive to your person appeared herein or in any other
> correspondence of mine to you, i apologise unreservedly.
>
> All the best,
>
> Hamjatta Kanteh
>
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