Asbjorn,

You have put together what I can HONESTLY call a MASTERPIECE.  Your
evaluations are not only lucid, but also shows a well applied balance
between both objectivity and subjectivity.

It is my belief that one must always call it like he/she see it, regardless
of the topic or individual concerned.  Giving credit where one is due and
not patronising each other by creating a groupthink is one of the key
elements which yields progress if the brilliant minds of this forum should
continue debating issues concerning our country.

It is amazing how you can so easily point out both the functional and
dysfuntional consequences of the APRC, and yet able to honestly deter from
being seeminly partial.

This forum is,  and should remain about the ISSUES and just that.  If one is
  a proponent of the APRC or againts the YAYA regime, he or she have the
right to point it out without any fear of intimidation or unfair
consequences, but it should be within the context of the subject at hand-
JUST THE ISSUES and nothing else.

You have for lack of a better word called A SPADE, A SPADE and subsequently
even attempted to make suggestions here and there to offer solutions to the
problem.


In conclusion, I appeal that you keep it coming, because it feels real good
and comforting to read such a brilliant and well presented article.

Just the ISSUES

LEKbi -Ablie Njie
Atlanta




>From: Asbjørn Nordam <[log in to unmask]>
>Reply-To: The Gambia and related-issues mailing list
><[log in to unmask]>
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: Misconceptions, Misunderstandings & Clarifications
>Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 07:47:36 +0100
>
>Mr. Gassama,
>you express my long time sentiments, when it comes to debate in The Gambia,
>or on the Gambia-L. And I could not have said it better than you do.
>
>A year ago I asked why is it, that some people on the list  praise and
>support each other, and express that those, who are not for are against.
>Why
>is it that in debates some have a tendency to force each other to the point
>of no return to a win-or-loose-situation. We must agree that we donīt see
>everything the same way around, and then what ? Why this wish for calling
>it
>all black or white. Things are not always black or white, letīs try and
>compromise sometimes, or just accept that we donīt agree.
>
>I also by coincident met people I only knew from the Gambia-L and that was
>really thrilling and a very good experience.
>
>Let me try in my poor english to give an impression, and risk an eye, how
>I,
>when it comes to the Gambia or gambian issues, am not only for or against.
>
>I have travelled since 78 to the Gambia and I like/love the country and
>most
>of the people I meet. I want to see the country developed, the faster the
>better. Like I try and learn and understand the people, history and
>tradition, I also try to understand different kinds of problem, from the
>ones inside a family, a compound, a village, up to the national and
>international ones.
>
>I accept if the people has got enough, they  try to get rid of their
>leaders, hopefully by ballot and not by a military take over as in The
>Gambia. But now itīs been like that, I can not change that situation, so I
>look forward and I do hope for the best. As in the Jawara days I did not
>see
>every thing black or white, itīs the same how I see the present president
>and government.
>
>  When I pay visits to The Gambia I am glad that there are so many
>progresses
>going on. Just to mention a few:
>I am happy that the country a few years back got a TV-station, to inform,
>educate the people, to give a platform for gambian culture. But at the same
>time I  could criticise the lack of  thorough  journalism on politics,
>national and local, like as a state-medium it should act more balanced.
>And even you have a state-supported news-station itīs important to
>accept/protect other private radio-stations, news-magazines etc. rights to
>also broadcast news.
>
>I am happy that there are so many schools build all over the country and
>old
>schools are renovated and more classrooms added. The numbers of students
>they are forced to take in at the Gambia College has increased dramatically
>over the past few years. They are stressed to the outmost out there at the
>college, but that is good.
>At the same time I am critical to the jobsituation for the teachers, the
>lack of materials in the educational system from top to bottom,  but I see
>it as a step in the right direction. The same with the university
>programmes. I can find many things to criticise in those programmes but
>again itīs a step, and you must as a poor country with limited resources
>take it step by step.
>
>Iīm glad that the government has given free education a higher priority, by
>letting the girls education be free. Hopefully it will soon also be free
>for
>the boys. I have often said itīs too expensive for an ordinary family to
>send their children into school. Many of my friends can not afford the high
>costs.
>
>I like the "fight"  with the infra structure, to build more roads, bridges
>and maybe also ferries. Get water and electricity supply up all over, and
>better the sanitary. The priority could be otherwise but I find it OK.
>And I have noticed that there is a plan to make The Gambia the gateway to
>Westafrica both in producing, transport, technology etc. I wait impatient
>to
>see it started and running.
>
>I like to see the struggle to find a way to be self-sufficient on
>food-production. I should like it to have a higher priority and based more
>on co-operatives , but again I do see many progress.
>But I certainly look for more job-intensive fabrics, so many families could
>earn a living, when a person could get a job in that sector. Donīt wait for
>the private sector, combine it with the state-enterprise.
>
>I like to see building of clinics and hospitals, even I at the same time
>find the lack of fundamental resources of medicine alarming. Last time in
>the Gambia I had to take two of my friends from clinic to clinic to get
>them
>the best treatment against malaria, one friend nearly died.
>
>I  blame the authorities and organisations, that there is a trend to ask
>for
>high academic degrees in jobs which could easily be handled by gambians
>educated in the gambia. When I read some of the job-descriptions when
>advertising for applicants, I think itīs crazy to offer such a salary on an
>university-degree candidate for a simple job as advisor, cashier, etc.
>
>I find it OK that the president and his party take some credit for many of
>these progresses, but I donīt like that he/they campaign as if those parts
>of the country, which are critical to him/the party should face
>destiny/fortune/revenge and not get the same progresses.
>
>And although I like the speed of all this I fear for the state budget and
>the tax-burden. Those who is going to pay for the progresses is the gambian
>people itself. And I should like the ordinary gambians to understand how
>"politics" are like. Those infrastructures are not god-given, gifts from
>president/APRC, but from themselves to themselves. That the state-budget is
>just a big-scale of a family-budget. There has to be income balanced with
>expenditures. And there are different political solutions to such
>development and progresses. In my opinion many politicians in the country
>fail to teach their supporters the differences between the different
>parties. It often ends up to be mostly a personal question, a man to man
>election, and not an election on principals. That is what I think fails in
>the political tradition, but I do hope this is also just a step forward.
>
>What I donīt like is the way the "control" of the country is build up. I
>have said it many times - I donīt like the road stops, the intimidation and
>harassment one can see daily in the streets practised by some men in
>uniform. To me they behave badly and not disciplined.
>I donīt like the reports of torture we from time to time gets from people
>and media. To me there is no excuse to torture other people. No mater if
>itīs in Denmark, USA, Chile, Balkan, The Gambia.
>And itīs embarrassing because The Gambia host the African center of human
>rights. Which on the other hand I think we should be proud of.
>
>In my opinion it is the police, who should take care of daily law and
>order,
>criminal acts of any kind, traffic, custom and boarder control. Not
>military
>or paramilitary nor NIA. The military should not be seen in the streets.
>They live their life in the barracks and are trained in combat, to protect
>The Gambia and itīs people from outside, and if possible serve
>internationally in peacekeeping forces, f.in. in Africa. I think there is
>great need to form an african peace-keeping force to solve conflicts inside
>Africa, And The Gambia could certainly take a position here. (Like small
>Denmark do in UN-peacekeeping forces all over) The national guard could be
>a
>special trained force of elite-soldiers, but they should behave very very
>disciplined.
>The NIA should certainly concentrate itīs activities on states-enemies, but
>under  political control. And I certainly donīt like the reports of people
>tortured under the authorities (NIA, Police, military) custody, even I know
>you can find the same here in the west. Like I criticise it here I want to
>do it out there.
>
>People in uniform seen in the streets should only be policemen. If a
>military is on his way to/from job and he is wearing a uniform, he should
>wear it correctly. I have seen too many men wearing a uniform in disorder.
>If a man employed in the army is on duty f.in. around the celebration of
>the
>re-election of the president, I expect those men to behave very, very
>orderly. Not dancing around, not cheering and saluting if not ordered. If
>those who ran around that day and night were not on duty, they should not
>wear uniform. In civilian clothes they could as their neighbour celebrate
>that victory.
>
>I also think that the legal system could be transformed a bit and the
>reputation of the courts established to a higher level of independence. A
>clear distinction between the three powers.
>You find the european system practised in the courts, even you have another
>african system, which I think could run together with the "imported" one.
>There is an african tradition that conflict are handled locally, where many
>people are involved. If one has done something to another person it
>involves
>in your traditional system the families on both sides to find a solution.
>Many people come up with their idea of solution, and later on you find the
>one which is accepted. Some sort of local tribunal. In our system you only
>involve the persons who are  directly involved, witnesses. Later the
>court/the judge enforce his/the laws sentence on you. I think that in small
>offences you could try and involve local tribunals, and let the courts only
>step in when itīs more serious. You spend too much time in courts to get
>too
>little out of it. And many of your judges are not gambians but from
>outside.
>They donīt know of the gambian society and they will judge out of that
>limited knowledge.
>
>I certainly donīt like the political system. The british/american system
>where the winner takes it all, is a very special form of democracy, which
>in
>my opinion leads to tendencies of small "wars", very partisan campaigns,
>when the election is coming up. The seats in a parliament should reflect
>the
>total numbers of voters cast on the different parties nationwide. Then you
>can have constituencies to ensure that the parliament-members also come
>from
>and represent different parts of a country. This is a general opinion of
>mine and has nothing specific to do with The Gambia.
>
>But I am critical towards some of the parties donīt work on the political
>issues or agenda between elections. Nor do they try and give next
>generation
>of leaders in the party a platform, which leads to lack of successors when
>the old guard leaves the stage light. That a party boycott parliament
>elections and give away the daily platform for political speeches, the
>chance to speak up in the parliament, that is one thing I really donīt
>understand. But that is maybe because Iīm ignorant. I certainly donīt like
>the buying of voters cards, or the tradition of giving gifts to your
>supposed supporters after winning. If you have rice to distribute then give
>it to the people in need, and not to those who you think were your
>dedicated
>supporters.
>
>I donīt know the president personally, and I will not judge him as a
>person.
>But what I should like to see is more of a FATHER-figure. He is the
>president for all gambians, the whole of The Gambia, and he should behave
>like that. Even he is out of a party and has a specific political platform
>and program to take out. I will not say that you all should love or like
>him, but he should in my opinion try and act more to win  respect from all.
>And he should also try and talk to our hearts. You could see he was happy
>the day the result came in and he was re-elected and he took a short ride
>out of the residence. Why should he just few days later threat people in
>public jobs, that if they have not voted for him, they were not able to be
>loyal and serve him and the state, and should fear for their jobs ?
>Why not use his authority to solve the situation after the april-incident,
>instead of putting forward the indemnity-act, which should serve all
>involved in crimes. I think he should take the reports and declare that
>something ran out of order, someone failed his duties and dismiss those in
>charge that day. Get it over with. And then let the boys who are now laying
>suffering at RV get the treatment and operations needed no matter where and
>what it costs be it in America, Russia, Egypt. And compensate the families.
>Let the student leader return and rest. To risk something, to risk your
>arm,
>that is a step towards reconciliation.
>And if the state has nothing important in the Dumo-trial, get it over with.
>Let the men free instead of playing a game that first one then the other
>prosecutor is ill. Get forward, try and do something. The truth and the
>compensation will always be disputed no matter what solution. So if I was
>the president I should try and get forward without that millstone round my
>neck.
>History will tell and judge, so no matter what he does there will be some
>who said he stood behind all this. I donīt see it as weakness or acceptance
>of any guilt to try and get forward. Thatīs how "cool and cruel" politics
>is
>and as I say, history will judge by the end.
>
>Like he is trying to do something towards former president Jawara. Try and
>get the old man back to a pensioners life in the Gambia. The old man is
>Gambian history no matter what you all think he did well or not so well or
>badly. He is your first president after independence, a vet who became your
>president. He belongs to your history and I think that President Jammeh do
>the right thing, get the man home under certain conditions.
>The President is taking a risk here. He really risk an arm. The man he
>forced out of office, he now try and get backk home. I want him to behave
>with the same courage on the DUMO case and the april incident.
>
>What I like is the priority he seems to give the women, in society, in
>public jobs, in politics. And many women love him for that attitude. And I
>think that is a good strategy. Itīs seen here in the west to become the
>best
>strategy to development, support the women out there.
>
>As a toubab from the rich west, I would like Jammeh to balance his
>well-placed critics towards "the west" with a more compromising attitude
>realizing that we are not all evil, new colonialists, some want to help and
>certainly itīs not us alone to dictate the conditions for the help. Be
>sceptic YES, but understand that we are many people out here, who want to
>put pressure on our leaders when it comes to helping developing and poor
>countries. And we must form a strategic alliance. We donīt want to take
>control.
>
>But generally the tax-payers here in Denmark want to see that the money
>they
>pay, is given to people in need. If possible people up here would go and
>hand the money over directly to the women in the african villages. That is
>the control we want, and reports that the money is well spend, or we have
>to
>do better. We also want to tell the leaders in certain countries which
>produce a long trail of refugees, that there must be a reason why many
>people wants to leave their homes to ensure life, and we ask such a
>government/leadership to look very critical into the reasons and try to do
>better, IF our taxpayers money should go and help building infrastructure
>in
>such a country. Itīs not that we want to dictate what kind of democracy a
>country should have or we only want to support an opposition, but try and
>ask why so many of your citizens flee.
>
>I would like the president to try and understand such arguments. He could
>direct so much taxpaid money from the west if he really wanted and without
>compromising on principles. Instead itīs poor people in Poland or Ukraine
>he
>ask for help, and we here in western Europe run several development
>programmes in both Poland and Ukraine. Itīs not logic.
>
>Iīm positive to the presidents vision that he maybe could get success being
>some kind of a mediator in african conflicts, and maybe also get support
>for
>his ideas of renewing the OAU-vision. If he get success  he will set a new
>standard of leadership. But I think he is balancing on the line which can
>lead to a fine leader, but it can also turn out that we will only remember
>him as a tyrant. Itīs a difficult balance, and history will judge him. I
>think that if he plays his cards well, show he is a human being who cares,
>also for those who are maybe not full hearted behind him he can be liked if
>not loved by many gambians.
>
>This is how I personally see some of the things in The Gambia. Not always
>black and white, positive and negative. In some perspectives I am for the
>President and APRC, like I  for some  reasons also are very critical
>towards
>the politics he and APRC stands for.  I should like to see him turn more as
>a father-figure for the country instead of using his whip so much  and give
>fine presents some places, he should rule fair, as the father of all
>gambians, also for the 35 % percent who preferred another person to lead
>the
>country. If he is not careful I think he can easily turn into a tyrant.
>
>In politics my sympathy is always with the people, and because I grow up as
>a student and took my political  standards in the 60īties Iīm still more
>for
>PDOIS than for UDP, sorry - but again this is not black and white.
>
>I will stop here, as usual it became too long, but me heart is always in
>The
>Gambia, and I like the Gambia-L to get information, to learn from the
>debates, to form my opinion on what to think and do. Keep up all of you.
>Copenhagen february 18.th
>Asbjørn Nordam
>
>
>
>
>
>on 16/02/02 18:38, MOMODOU BUHARRY GASSAMA at [log in to unmask] wrote:
>
> > Hi!
> > As the political beliefs and positions of the various individuals that
>have
> > not taken an "everything or nothing" view with regard to the government
>in The
> > Gambia are very diverse, I think it is misleading to attribute blanket
> > statements to them. Statements have been made during the past few days
>that
> > are generally attributed to those who do not belong to the "everything
>or
> > nothing" group and these statements do not in the least represent my
>position.
> > I can keep quiet and be guilty by association, or I can offer
>clarification
> > with regard to the various misconceptions.
>
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