Mr.NOrdam,
         Even objectivity itself will acccept the objective part of your
piece! If criticism is balanced then judgement shouldn't be based on
prejudice therefore I AM HAPPY TO SAY that you were FAIR and thats it!
Thank you!

YEROPULLOH!


>From: Asbjørn Nordam <[log in to unmask]>
>Reply-To: The Gambia and related-issues mailing list
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>Subject: Re: Misconceptions, Misunderstandings & Clarifications
>Date: Mon, 25 Feb 2002 07:47:36 +0100
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>Mr. Gassama,
>you express my long time sentiments, when it comes to debate in The Gambia,
>or on the Gambia-L. And I could not have said it better than you do.
>
>A year ago I asked why is it, that some people on the list  praise and
>support each other, and express that those, who are not for are against.
>Why
>is it that in debates some have a tendency to force each other to the point
>of no return to a win-or-loose-situation. We must agree that we donīt see
>everything the same way around, and then what ? Why this wish for calling
>it
>all black or white. Things are not always black or white, letīs try and
>compromise sometimes, or just accept that we donīt agree.
>
>I also by coincident met people I only knew from the Gambia-L and that was
>really thrilling and a very good experience.
>
>Let me try in my poor english to give an impression, and risk an eye, how
>I,
>when it comes to the Gambia or gambian issues, am not only for or against.
>
>I have travelled since 78 to the Gambia and I like/love the country and
>most
>of the people I meet. I want to see the country developed, the faster the
>better. Like I try and learn and understand the people, history and
>tradition, I also try to understand different kinds of problem, from the
>ones inside a family, a compound, a village, up to the national and
>international ones.
>
>I accept if the people has got enough, they  try to get rid of their
>leaders, hopefully by ballot and not by a military take over as in The
>Gambia. But now itīs been like that, I can not change that situation, so I
>look forward and I do hope for the best. As in the Jawara days I did not
>see
>every thing black or white, itīs the same how I see the present president
>and government.
>
>  When I pay visits to The Gambia I am glad that there are so many
>progresses
>going on. Just to mention a few:
>I am happy that the country a few years back got a TV-station, to inform,
>educate the people, to give a platform for gambian culture. But at the same
>time I  could criticise the lack of  thorough  journalism on politics,
>national and local, like as a state-medium it should act more balanced.
>And even you have a state-supported news-station itīs important to
>accept/protect other private radio-stations, news-magazines etc. rights to
>also broadcast news.
>
>I am happy that there are so many schools build all over the country and
>old
>schools are renovated and more classrooms added. The numbers of students
>they are forced to take in at the Gambia College has increased dramatically
>over the past few years. They are stressed to the outmost out there at the
>college, but that is good.
>At the same time I am critical to the jobsituation for the teachers, the
>lack of materials in the educational system from top to bottom,  but I see
>it as a step in the right direction. The same with the university
>programmes. I can find many things to criticise in those programmes but
>again itīs a step, and you must as a poor country with limited resources
>take it step by step.
>
>Iīm glad that the government has given free education a higher priority, by
>letting the girls education be free. Hopefully it will soon also be free
>for
>the boys. I have often said itīs too expensive for an ordinary family to
>send their children into school. Many of my friends can not afford the high
>costs.
>
>I like the "fight"  with the infra structure, to build more roads, bridges
>and maybe also ferries. Get water and electricity supply up all over, and
>better the sanitary. The priority could be otherwise but I find it OK.
>And I have noticed that there is a plan to make The Gambia the gateway to
>Westafrica both in producing, transport, technology etc. I wait impatient
>to
>see it started and running.
>
>I like to see the struggle to find a way to be self-sufficient on
>food-production. I should like it to have a higher priority and based more
>on co-operatives , but again I do see many progress.
>But I certainly look for more job-intensive fabrics, so many families could
>earn a living, when a person could get a job in that sector. Donīt wait for
>the private sector, combine it with the state-enterprise.
>
>I like to see building of clinics and hospitals, even I at the same time
>find the lack of fundamental resources of medicine alarming. Last time in
>the Gambia I had to take two of my friends from clinic to clinic to get
>them
>the best treatment against malaria, one friend nearly died.
>
>I  blame the authorities and organisations, that there is a trend to ask
>for
>high academic degrees in jobs which could easily be handled by gambians
>educated in the gambia. When I read some of the job-descriptions when
>advertising for applicants, I think itīs crazy to offer such a salary on an
>university-degree candidate for a simple job as advisor, cashier, etc.
>
>I find it OK that the president and his party take some credit for many of
>these progresses, but I donīt like that he/they campaign as if those parts
>of the country, which are critical to him/the party should face
>destiny/fortune/revenge and not get the same progresses.
>
>And although I like the speed of all this I fear for the state budget and
>the tax-burden. Those who is going to pay for the progresses is the gambian
>people itself. And I should like the ordinary gambians to understand how
>"politics" are like. Those infrastructures are not god-given, gifts from
>president/APRC, but from themselves to themselves. That the state-budget is
>just a big-scale of a family-budget. There has to be income balanced with
>expenditures. And there are different political solutions to such
>development and progresses. In my opinion many politicians in the country
>fail to teach their supporters the differences between the different
>parties. It often ends up to be mostly a personal question, a man to man
>election, and not an election on principals. That is what I think fails in
>the political tradition, but I do hope this is also just a step forward.
>
>What I donīt like is the way the "control" of the country is build up. I
>have said it many times - I donīt like the road stops, the intimidation and
>harassment one can see daily in the streets practised by some men in
>uniform. To me they behave badly and not disciplined.
>I donīt like the reports of torture we from time to time gets from people
>and media. To me there is no excuse to torture other people. No mater if
>itīs in Denmark, USA, Chile, Balkan, The Gambia.
>And itīs embarrassing because The Gambia host the African center of human
>rights. Which on the other hand I think we should be proud of.
>
>In my opinion it is the police, who should take care of daily law and
>order,
>criminal acts of any kind, traffic, custom and boarder control. Not
>military
>or paramilitary nor NIA. The military should not be seen in the streets.
>They live their life in the barracks and are trained in combat, to protect
>The Gambia and itīs people from outside, and if possible serve
>internationally in peacekeeping forces, f.in. in Africa. I think there is
>great need to form an african peace-keeping force to solve conflicts inside
>Africa, And The Gambia could certainly take a position here. (Like small
>Denmark do in UN-peacekeeping forces all over) The national guard could be
>a
>special trained force of elite-soldiers, but they should behave very very
>disciplined.
>The NIA should certainly concentrate itīs activities on states-enemies, but
>under  political control. And I certainly donīt like the reports of people
>tortured under the authorities (NIA, Police, military) custody, even I know
>you can find the same here in the west. Like I criticise it here I want to
>do it out there.
>
>People in uniform seen in the streets should only be policemen. If a
>military is on his way to/from job and he is wearing a uniform, he should
>wear it correctly. I have seen too many men wearing a uniform in disorder.
>If a man employed in the army is on duty f.in. around the celebration of
>the
>re-election of the president, I expect those men to behave very, very
>orderly. Not dancing around, not cheering and saluting if not ordered. If
>those who ran around that day and night were not on duty, they should not
>wear uniform. In civilian clothes they could as their neighbour celebrate
>that victory.
>
>I also think that the legal system could be transformed a bit and the
>reputation of the courts established to a higher level of independence. A
>clear distinction between the three powers.
>You find the european system practised in the courts, even you have another
>african system, which I think could run together with the "imported" one.
>There is an african tradition that conflict are handled locally, where many
>people are involved. If one has done something to another person it
>involves
>in your traditional system the families on both sides to find a solution.
>Many people come up with their idea of solution, and later on you find the
>one which is accepted. Some sort of local tribunal. In our system you only
>involve the persons who are  directly involved, witnesses. Later the
>court/the judge enforce his/the laws sentence on you. I think that in small
>offences you could try and involve local tribunals, and let the courts only
>step in when itīs more serious. You spend too much time in courts to get
>too
>little out of it. And many of your judges are not gambians but from
>outside.
>They donīt know of the gambian society and they will judge out of that
>limited knowledge.
>
>I certainly donīt like the political system. The british/american system
>where the winner takes it all, is a very special form of democracy, which
>in
>my opinion leads to tendencies of small "wars", very partisan campaigns,
>when the election is coming up. The seats in a parliament should reflect
>the
>total numbers of voters cast on the different parties nationwide. Then you
>can have constituencies to ensure that the parliament-members also come
>from
>and represent different parts of a country. This is a general opinion of
>mine and has nothing specific to do with The Gambia.
>
>But I am critical towards some of the parties donīt work on the political
>issues or agenda between elections. Nor do they try and give next
>generation
>of leaders in the party a platform, which leads to lack of successors when
>the old guard leaves the stage light. That a party boycott parliament
>elections and give away the daily platform for political speeches, the
>chance to speak up in the parliament, that is one thing I really donīt
>understand. But that is maybe because Iīm ignorant. I certainly donīt like
>the buying of voters cards, or the tradition of giving gifts to your
>supposed supporters after winning. If you have rice to distribute then give
>it to the people in need, and not to those who you think were your
>dedicated
>supporters.
>
>I donīt know the president personally, and I will not judge him as a
>person.
>But what I should like to see is more of a FATHER-figure. He is the
>president for all gambians, the whole of The Gambia, and he should behave
>like that. Even he is out of a party and has a specific political platform
>and program to take out. I will not say that you all should love or like
>him, but he should in my opinion try and act more to win  respect from all.
>And he should also try and talk to our hearts. You could see he was happy
>the day the result came in and he was re-elected and he took a short ride
>out of the residence. Why should he just few days later threat people in
>public jobs, that if they have not voted for him, they were not able to be
>loyal and serve him and the state, and should fear for their jobs ?
>Why not use his authority to solve the situation after the april-incident,
>instead of putting forward the indemnity-act, which should serve all
>involved in crimes. I think he should take the reports and declare that
>something ran out of order, someone failed his duties and dismiss those in
>charge that day. Get it over with. And then let the boys who are now laying
>suffering at RV get the treatment and operations needed no matter where and
>what it costs be it in America, Russia, Egypt. And compensate the families.
>Let the student leader return and rest. To risk something, to risk your
>arm,
>that is a step towards reconciliation.
>And if the state has nothing important in the Dumo-trial, get it over with.
>Let the men free instead of playing a game that first one then the other
>prosecutor is ill. Get forward, try and do something. The truth and the
>compensation will always be disputed no matter what solution. So if I was
>the president I should try and get forward without that millstone round my
>neck.
>History will tell and judge, so no matter what he does there will be some
>who said he stood behind all this. I donīt see it as weakness or acceptance
>of any guilt to try and get forward. Thatīs how "cool and cruel" politics
>is
>and as I say, history will judge by the end.
>
>Like he is trying to do something towards former president Jawara. Try and
>get the old man back to a pensioners life in the Gambia. The old man is
>Gambian history no matter what you all think he did well or not so well or
>badly. He is your first president after independence, a vet who became your
>president. He belongs to your history and I think that President Jammeh do
>the right thing, get the man home under certain conditions.
>The President is taking a risk here. He really risk an arm. The man he
>forced out of office, he now try and get backk home. I want him to behave
>with the same courage on the DUMO case and the april incident.
>
>What I like is the priority he seems to give the women, in society, in
>public jobs, in politics. And many women love him for that attitude. And I
>think that is a good strategy. Itīs seen here in the west to become the
>best
>strategy to development, support the women out there.
>
>As a toubab from the rich west, I would like Jammeh to balance his
>well-placed critics towards "the west" with a more compromising attitude
>realizing that we are not all evil, new colonialists, some want to help and
>certainly itīs not us alone to dictate the conditions for the help. Be
>sceptic YES, but understand that we are many people out here, who want to
>put pressure on our leaders when it comes to helping developing and poor
>countries. And we must form a strategic alliance. We donīt want to take
>control.
>
>But generally the tax-payers here in Denmark want to see that the money
>they
>pay, is given to people in need. If possible people up here would go and
>hand the money over directly to the women in the african villages. That is
>the control we want, and reports that the money is well spend, or we have
>to
>do better. We also want to tell the leaders in certain countries which
>produce a long trail of refugees, that there must be a reason why many
>people wants to leave their homes to ensure life, and we ask such a
>government/leadership to look very critical into the reasons and try to do
>better, IF our taxpayers money should go and help building infrastructure
>in
>such a country. Itīs not that we want to dictate what kind of democracy a
>country should have or we only want to support an opposition, but try and
>ask why so many of your citizens flee.
>
>I would like the president to try and understand such arguments. He could
>direct so much taxpaid money from the west if he really wanted and without
>compromising on principles. Instead itīs poor people in Poland or Ukraine
>he
>ask for help, and we here in western Europe run several development
>programmes in both Poland and Ukraine. Itīs not logic.
>
>Iīm positive to the presidents vision that he maybe could get success being
>some kind of a mediator in african conflicts, and maybe also get support
>for
>his ideas of renewing the OAU-vision. If he get success  he will set a new
>standard of leadership. But I think he is balancing on the line which can
>lead to a fine leader, but it can also turn out that we will only remember
>him as a tyrant. Itīs a difficult balance, and history will judge him. I
>think that if he plays his cards well, show he is a human being who cares,
>also for those who are maybe not full hearted behind him he can be liked if
>not loved by many gambians.
>
>This is how I personally see some of the things in The Gambia. Not always
>black and white, positive and negative. In some perspectives I am for the
>President and APRC, like I  for some  reasons also are very critical
>towards
>the politics he and APRC stands for.  I should like to see him turn more as
>a father-figure for the country instead of using his whip so much  and give
>fine presents some places, he should rule fair, as the father of all
>gambians, also for the 35 % percent who preferred another person to lead
>the
>country. If he is not careful I think he can easily turn into a tyrant.
>
>In politics my sympathy is always with the people, and because I grow up as
>a student and took my political  standards in the 60īties Iīm still more
>for
>PDOIS than for UDP, sorry - but again this is not black and white.
>
>I will stop here, as usual it became too long, but me heart is always in
>The
>Gambia, and I like the Gambia-L to get information, to learn from the
>debates, to form my opinion on what to think and do. Keep up all of you.
>Copenhagen february 18.th
>Asbjørn Nordam
>
>
>
>
>
>on 16/02/02 18:38, MOMODOU BUHARRY GASSAMA at [log in to unmask] wrote:
>
> > Hi!
> > As the political beliefs and positions of the various individuals that
>have
> > not taken an "everything or nothing" view with regard to the government
>in The
> > Gambia are very diverse, I think it is misleading to attribute blanket
> > statements to them. Statements have been made during the past few days
>that
> > are generally attributed to those who do not belong to the "everything
>or
> > nothing" group and these statements do not in the least represent my
>position.
> > I can keep quiet and be guilty by association, or I can offer
>clarification
> > with regard to the various misconceptions.
>
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"YEROMAMA PULORI GALO HAAWA BAROGEL N'DIMOU"
"Speak the speeches and let the speeches not spit you."


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