Bailo, I think I will leave this one to JDAM for I think there are enormous teachable moments here which are best left to JDAM. Your sideswipes on me will me forgiven temporarily. But you know you can count on me to wake your lil behind up after you get through with JDAM. And if JDAM takes too long (Like I know he likes to do sometimes just to forestall war) I'm comin' in. If there's one thing you know by now, it is that you do not have to address Haruna by name at Ellen for him to go bunkers on you. Later Gaddamit. Haruna. Tue. 3/2/10. from Bailo Jallow. Re: The first recorded history of lesbian marriage in Mangambougou. LJD, Your usual gentlemanly approach of discussing issues of interest to you is inspiring. Before answering the question that you posed me, I would like to state that my position on homosexuality is foremost guided by my religious and cultural convictions as a Moslem. As such, I believe that homosexuality is an abomination to be shunned and not to be encouraged. However, I also believe that the type of sexual activities that consenting adults engage in within the confines of their bedrooms or private domains should not fall within the purview of any person or authority. What ought to concern someone else is what is practiced or displayed in the public arena. I am please to have similar sentiments on this issue with hundreds of millions of peoples (Jews, Christians, Bahaians, Hindus, Rastafarians, Atheists, etc) from all over the world. Now regarding your question, I would firmly discourage any local or external attempt towards influencing Gambian laws to have homosexuality or same-sex marriage recognised as perfectly legal. I do not however think that anyone found guilty of such a vice should be ‘beheaded’. Re-orientation in a correctional facility might be the best solution. In conclusion, I do not support the legalisation of same sex marriages or homosexuality from a moral, cultural and natural perspective. Cheers Bailo -----Original Message----- From: Lamin Darbo <[log in to unmask]> To: [log in to unmask] Sent: Sun, Feb 28, 2010 8:44 pm Subject: Re: The first recorded Lesbian marriage in Mangambougou, Mali. I say happy gammy! Bailo Assuming your position is accepted, what manner of conversation would you recommend between The Republic of The Gambia, and its homosexual community? I am proceeding on the basis that like in the Malian example, some members of homosexual Gambia may insist on living with their significant others in a marriage, or in relationships akin to a marriage. Is your concern, and, or rejection of homosexuality restricted to moral condemnation, or do you consider it proper for the law to punitively intervene? LJDarbo --- On Sun, 28/2/10, bailo jallow <[log in to unmask]> wrote: From: bailo jallow <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: The first recorded Lesbian marriage in Mangambougou, Mali. I say happy gammy! To: [log in to unmask] Date: Sunday, 28 February, 2010, 16:53 Haruna, We cannot avoid discussing the global context under which the Lesbian union in Mali took place. Since our World is categorised in terms of Westerners, Easterners, Southerners and Northerners, then what is the classification of those countries that are spearheading the promotion of homesexuality as universal human value/rights? All I am saying based on real life experiences is that the Africans in particular should not accept the imposition of such vices such as homosexuality upon us as human rights values. Bailo --- On Sat, 27/2/10, Haruna Darbo <[log in to unmask]> wrote: From: Haruna Darbo <[log in to unmask]> Subject: Re: The first recorded Lesbian marriage in Mangambougou, Mali. I say happy gammy! To: [log in to unmask] Date: Saturday, 27 February, 2010, 2:57 Okho Bailo! Why are you bringing western countries into this? I agree with your sentiment as far as decadence but it is about time we place blame or glory where it belongs. Only Mangambougou community and Mali are involved in this. Let us speak about the rights or decadence of the two individuals within the context of their community. No western country encouraged or discouraged this one Bailo. You were on the roll for a minute and I was with you. The problem is when we Africans commute our problems and blames on other, we will never be inspired to solve them or at least harness them for any extraneous value. Okho. You had me going for a while. Like the energizer bunny. Until I saw western. Human Rights is not the domain of western countries again. You will come to realize all men are the same and have similar desires, particularly carnal and romantic. The reason why we haven't entertained as much decadence as you see in the west is simply because we have other more mundane considerations for now...like breakfast, lunch, dinner, hesal, firewood, Ramadan, Lailatul Qadri, etcetera. Wait till we don't have those worries anymore. You'll see decadence like you've never seen before. Ghana and Mali will be our test site for west africa I feel for Oko. The one man army. Haruna. -----Original Message----- From: bailo jallow <[log in to unmask]> To: [log in to unmask] Sent: Fri, Feb 26, 2010 6:52 pm Subject: Re: The first recorded Lesbian marriage in Mangambougou, Mali. I say happy gammy! Most Western countries have laws banning polygamy yet these same governments lead in condemning other countries that legislate against pervasions such as homosexuality. Talking about spreading moral decadence in the world in the guise of human rights! Bailo --- On Fri, 26/2/10, Haruna Darbo <[log in to unmask]> wrote: From: Haruna Darbo <[log in to unmask]> Subject: The first recorded Lesbian marriage in Mangambougou, Mali. I say happy gammy! To: [log in to unmask] Date: Friday, 26 February, 2010, 3:45 Culled from AFRIBONE-CN / The AURORA newspaper. Haruna. You know what comes next don't you? These are some of the growing pains of democracy. But total commitment to democracy requires you let folk be as long as they do not infringe on the rights of their fellows. I am sad however. But I will accept it because they have the right. I'd rather they do it out in the open than have to hide their consciences. Mariage homosexuel à la mairie de Magnambougou Deux femmes officiellement unies pour le meilleur et le pire Ce que les gardiens du temple redoutaient le plus est déjà arrivé au Mali : L’union des homosexuel(le)s. Quand bien même les textes aujourd’hui en vigueur dans notre pays interdisent la pratique, ce couple a trouvé la parade infaillible en célébrant son union par le centre d’État Civil de Magnamboubou. Le mariage homosexuel par définition, est une union célébrée entre deux personnes (homme et femme) ayant la même tendance sexuelle. Il s’agit, en clair, de l’union d’un homme d’avec une femme (et non de deux hommes ou de deux femmes eux ou elles) ayant les mêmes penchants sexuels. La nuance est de taille. Mais aujourd’hui, force est d’admettre que le concept a profondément évolué. Dans l’imaginaire populaire, un mariage homo concerne deux personnes de même sexe. C’est le cas à l’ordre du jour ici. L’une se fait appeler « B » et l’autre « F.C ». Selon toute évidence, c’est « F.C » qui joue le rôle d’époux. Elle réside en Suède, pays de tolérance sexuelle par excellence. Quant à « B », elle vit dans la capitale malienne à Magnambougou, dans une villa que lui a généreusement offerte son « mari » depuis la Suède. Cette dernière, « F.C », ne lésine pas sur les moyens. Elle est très riche et a entrepris de faire expatrier son « épouse ». Le couple s’est connu à travers Internet, sur un site de rencontres. Depuis, elles n’ont jamais arrêté de se fréquenter. C’est F.C qui effectue régulièrement le déplacement sur Bamako. Sur place, elle partage la même villa et la même chambre que « B ». Un secret de polichinelle pour les voisins du quartier Magnambougou ! Mais comment pareille union a pu être célébrée dans un pays où la pratique est prohibée et, de surcroit, par une autorité légitime, à savoir le maire du quartier ? C’est au mois de d’Octobre-Novembre que le drôle mariage a été consacré, non au centre d’État civil, mais à domicile. De source bien au fait de l’histoire, un homme a pris la place de « F.C » et les papiers d’identité des deux époux ont été délibérément falsifiés. Le choix du domicile avait pour but de limiter la présence des curieux. Dans la législation malienne, rien n’interdit la consécration d’une union civile à domicile par un officier d’État civil. La pratique se trouve cependant en porte-à-faux avec le principe de la publicité du mariage lequel constitue un acte public par excellence. En somme, le domicile est une propriété privée dont l’accès peut être limité alors que le mariage reste un acte public ouvert à tous. En célébrant donc une union à domicile, les époux peuvent restreindre l’accès de cette cérémonie à caractère public. La stratégie s’est avérée payante pour « B » et « F.C ». Seul(es) les intimes, et quel(les) intimes, ont pu accéder ce jour, à l’autel. Le maire dont la bonne foi n’est pas en cause, en tout cas, jusqu’à la preuve du contraire, a tout simplement usé d’une prérogative et a cautionné le fait. Aujourd’hui, l’épouse « B », sur incitation de son « mari » FC cherche à s’expatrier en Suède où la pratique des unions libres est reconnue. Au Mali, elle n’a aucune valeur juridique puisque le code du mariage précise bien que l’union est célébrée entre homme et femme. Un concept qui, malheureusement, connaît aujourd’hui ses limites dans la mesure où la science parvient dorénavant à faire changer le sexe biologique d’une personne. En somme, une femme peut désormais s’octroyer les caractères secondaires mâles et un homme de même par rapport aux attributs femelles. Toute chose qui met à défaut le principe malien selon lequel le mariage n’est célébré qu’entre homme et femme… « De naissance » n’aurait pas été de trop… Et si l’on revoyait sérieusement ce fameux code du mariage, sans passion, s’il vous plaît ! B.S. Diarra L’Aurore du 25 Février 2010. ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤