Hmmm! Chuckles as usual to our Gambian-L drag. On Wed, Aug 7, 2013 at 8:45 AM, Demba Baldeh <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > Interesting... well, now that we dealt with everybody from the PhD's; > Imams to the street beggars; it is about time we look in the mirror and > deal with ourselves... Just saying... > > Eid Mubarak in advance... > > Demba > > > On Tue, Aug 6, 2013 at 6:02 PM, Joe Joe <[log in to unmask]> wrote: > >> Khaleel, thanks for your response and clarification. That was my take and >> since you reiterated that, that is not where you were headed, that is >> sufficient for me. Now, you have been around and know that we have dealt >> with the Supreme Islamic Council, BAR Association, opposition leaders, >> Priests, Village Heads, and I can go on and on and the who is who in >> Gambian society. So, it baffles me that with all that background you will >> think that only a few PhDs are put on the chopping block or to bear our >> weight. We cannot talk about all of them in one sitting, but nonetheless, >> we shall discuss all those found wanting and in time. Unfortunately, ours >> is like trying to fill a basket with water - there are too many of such >> characters to last us a lifetime, but it is a fight we must continue as we >> fight to take back Gambia. >> >> Joe >> >> ------------------------------ >> Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2013 19:45:58 -0400 >> >> From: [log in to unmask] >> Subject: Re: [G_L] Khaleel and co under attack: Gambian Drs and PhD >> holders not the solution then: Who is David Bansama >> To: [log in to unmask] >> >> Joe, >> >> >> >> You are absolutely entitled to your opinion especially your >> interpretation of any literature. I read what David wrote and you read it >> as well. It is not uncommon for both of us to come to a different >> conclusion. I understand the issues you have with them and I share some of >> your sentiments. >> >> It is wrong by any measure for anyone to chase fame and fortune while >> sacrificing personal courage, integrity and basic human decency and then >> turn around to attempt to lead a crusade against someone you decided to get >> cozy with and serve. >> >> My conscience cannot let me condone to that but we can't make a mistake >> though, to narrow that conversation to a few PHD/DR holders “so called >> intellectuals” in our society. >> >> There are many things wrong in our society and a whole lot of people are >> contributing to what is wrong in the Gambia, a lot more than the few >> so-called intellectuals. That doesn’t make it ok by any means for them >> to add salt to the wound either. >> >> How many positions are in Yaya’s government? Compare that to the few held >> by these PHD/DRs and you will have a lot more positions left filled by our >> brothers and sisters. >> >> Joe I am not in the business of defending a grown man/woman who can do >> that better for themselves. I gain nothing from that brother. I write and >> speak with conviction just like you and I am not too big to render apology >> when I am wrong. Please read my posting earlier today in response to David. >> Below is an extract from his article we are talking about: >> >> >> >> “He did not think of the average man who sees him and his Ph. D as a >> savior. He let them down. He did not see the poor farmer in Njain Sanjal, >> Badibu, Niumi, Jarra and Kiang looking up to them (the intellectuals/ *Borom >> Hamham yi*) to save our small Gambia from the disaster it has already >> slid into. *Our intellectuals indeed!!!”.* >> >> * * >> >> I am not in the business of endorsing people or provide them lukewarm >> excuses but I respect people for their views and opinions. I wrote about >> this particular article exactly how I understood it. I follow your postings >> here and I know you are a very opinionated person, a quality we share. I >> guess we will just have a difference in opinion on this one. Stay blessed. >> >> >> Khaleel >> >> >> >> Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2013 17:25:36 -0500 >> From: [log in to unmask] >> Subject: Re: [G_L] Khaleel and co under attack: Gambian Drs and PhD >> holders not the solution then: Who is David Bansama >> To: [log in to unmask] >> >> Khaleel, I think there is a slight difference between the gist of your >> write-up against what David said with respect to expectations we have >> regarding PhDs. None is giving them one more pond of any load to carry much >> more total responsibility of our burden. Myissue with these guys is they >> sold their soul, got kicked out, and then have the nerve to portray >> themselves as our libertors, to which some of us told them to get lost. How >> is that expecting them to shoulder our responsibility? We are dwelling on >> the behavior of these guys for their attempts on us and the lies they carry >> with them. The issue is not whether they are human and circumstance, but >> talking about their character and behavior just like we do daily with Yaya. >> There are no sacred cows here and if there are any left then a notice is >> being served, for we will expose them. Your main gist is what threw me a >> curve ball, because it can be viewed as a lukewarm defense or left hand >> endorsement of some of these characters. That may not have been your >> intent, but that is how it came across to me in the main. >> >> Joe >> >> ------------------------------ >> Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2013 12:38:15 -0400 >> From: [log in to unmask] >> Subject: Re: [G_L] Khaleel and co under attack: Gambian Drs and PhD >> holders not the solution then: Who is David Bansama >> To: [log in to unmask] >> >> >> Thanks Sountou for sharing yet another piece from David. I know David >> is reading, below is my response: >> >> David, >> >> Thanks for taking the time out whether to elaborate more on your points >> or to repeat/clarify points previously made that I obviously missed. I >> still stand by what my interpretation of your article was and I am certain >> you will do the same as well. Words have meanings and meanings can be >> flexible at times depending on who is reading or writing. To me, your list >> associated those individuals to a high degree of responsibility or lack of >> to our national development. While you, the readers and I may have some >> minor differences on use of words, concept and interpretation which won’t >> go away, I will like to focus on what we agree on if that’s ok with you. >> >> I think we are saying the same thing here for the most part David. We >> both don’t expect the PHD/DRs to be the agent of change in our country; we >> both agree that given their intellectual capacity, they should play a role >> worthy of emulation in this time of despair. We also agree that the >> responsibility of our nation building rests in the hands of many not few. >> These are pretty significant things we agree on and I pray that our >> deeds match our words for the most rather than the few who will shoulder >> this crusade to lead our nation in the near future. I also pray for all of >> us to be steadfast, humble, respect one another and reason well with each >> other. I look forward to reading more from you. Have a blessed day and >> happy eid in advance. >> >> Khaleel >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> Date: Tue, 6 Aug 2013 12:15:29 +0100 >> From: [log in to unmask] >> Subject: [G_L] Khaleel and co under attack: Gambian Drs and PhD holders >> not the solution then: Who is David Bansama >> To: [log in to unmask] >> >> Gambian intellectuals Are Not Agents of Change<http://kibaaro.com/gambian-intellectuals-are-not-agents-of-change/> >> Reads :274 >> *OURS IS A CRUSADE TO CLEANSE* *OUR SOCIETY OF THESE PARASITES >> * >> >> >> >> *By David Bansama* >> *“David is over stretching their role……. The expectation that less than >> one percent of our population should shoulder the responsibility to lead >> and effect change because they attained the highest level of education is >> not real” – Says Khaleel Jameel on Gambia L* >> >> When I wrote my piece last week, I knew (and expected) it would generate >> a lot of discourse because it is not the norm (to talk in less favourable >> terms about people held in reverence) in our milieu. What I did not expect, >> however, was an attempt (whether by design or default) to infer meanings >> into my piece which I have not inferred. Thank God, I am still alive, I >> will go back to re-iterate my position. >> >> Learning from history, I have never expected the Gambian Ph. Ds (or >> intellectuals) to be the agents of change in our country (even though they >> can) and I have never expected them to “shoulder the responsibility”. We >> learnt from history that in societies where change was effected, it was >> usually the common man who took the lead. For instance, the popular French >> Revolution was led by the common man; the American war of Independence was >> not led by the Ph.Ds; the Russian revolt against the Czars was led by the >> common man; coming home, one of the Fathers of Gambia’s Independence, Sir >> Dawda Jawara; was first identified and chosen by the common man to >> represent them. Even at that, he hesitated and contemplated possible >> financial losses especially as a family man (stated by Sir Dawda in his own >> book). Some of the members that attended the Marlborough Conference to >> discuss Gambia’s independence were barely literate. In recent times, the >> change that Brazil, one of the emerging markets (BRICS), is experiencing >> was initiated by Lula Da Silva who is not a Ph.D but a common Trade >> Unionist from the masses; Hugo Chavez (despite Western vilification) >> brought immense changes to his country for the common man and he did it >> without attaining a Ph.D. The man that everybody loves (Nelson Mandela) >> changed the course of history in South Africa without attaining a Ph. D. >> Likewise, all the Gambian Liberation Movements (as numerous as they are) >> were not initiated by Gambian Ph.Ds. Please correct me if I am wrong. These >> “intellectuals” are usually the comfortable lot who like lording it over >> the rest after the battle had been fought and won. Let me just give a >> casual example here: isn’t it interesting to see on Maafanta, the FB >> exchanges between our former Honourable Foreign Minister, Sidi Sanneh, who >> did not attend the events in Raleigh and Stockholm but wants quick results >> (in terms of reports) and is so brazen about it? He even trivializes the >> matter rather unwittingly (just like he did with Yahya Jammeh’s underpants) >> by zooming on the latest gadgets brought to the meetings, interestingly >> putting it in this rather de-meaning fashion “…*I did not attend either >> of the meetings but I was told about the fancy gadgets”.*Isn’t this >> cheap and petty for Sidi himself? Where were his brain and conscience at >> the time of penning this particular line? When I read it, I was tempted to >> ask: Was it gadgets that concerned you most about the meetings or the >> substance? How trivial and petty could one be? >> >> Having said the above, what I (and the majority of the poverty-stricken >> Gambians) do not, however, expect from our Ph.Ds and other “intellectuals” >> is *the aiding and abetting of the current Gambian dictatorship in >> brutalising our people because of their own selfish interest*. By the >> way, do you know there are some of these “intellectuals” who still >> clandestinely work with the Dictatorship in Banjul even after Jammeh had >> shown them the way out in the most cavalier manner? We have full dossiers >> on most of them and, at the opportune time, will share it with the rest of >> our compatriots to buttress our point on how cheap but dangerous some of >> our “intellectuals” can be. It is not a threat. *Ours is a crusade in >> which we are determined to cleanse our society of these parasites*. All >> of the people I mentioned in my write-up joined the regime after Gambians >> have seen enough PHYSICAL EVIDENCE OF JAMMEH’s BRUTALITY. What more lessons >> did they need to understand that Jammeh is deranged and derailed, and >> therefore did not mean well for our people? With their supposed exposure >> and level of “education”, they ought to have known better. This was the >> thrust of my message and I thought it was crystal clear to even the most >> casual reader. >> >> Now flipping the debate in Khaleel’s way, even if we assumed “less than >> one percent of our population should shoulder the responsibility to lead >> and effect change because they attained the highest level of education”, >> this cannot still be considered an “over-stretching” of their role, >> especially if we take education as a means to better our societies. This is >> aptly conveyed to you at the point of getting your degrees for it is said >> you have been found “*worthy in learning and character*” to be conferred >> a Bachelors, Masters or a Ph.D. as the case may be. I believe, 50 Gambian >> PH.Ds (less than one percent of the Gambian population but with the right >> mindset and strength of character) selflessly working together, can bring >> immense benefit to our people. It is all about honesty, principles and >> patriotism (not the narrow and twisted definition as coined by our >> Professor in Banjul). >> >> With regards to the rest of what Khaleel said and emphasised “*Let’s not >> forget that these PHD/Doctorate holders are Gambians, they are packed with >> all flaws each and every Gambian of us has*”, I have already belaboured >> on this fact in both my opening and concluding paragraphs, so I need not >> repeat that. I would just refer you to these paragraphs to confirm for >> yourself what I have already said. >> >> I believe we should all be held accountable for our actions especially >> during these trying times. >> >> >> [image: Print Friendly]<http://www.printfriendly.com/print?url=http://kibaaro.com/gambian-intellectuals-are-not-agents-of-change/> >> Share this: >> >> - >> <http://kibaaro.com/gambian-intellectuals-are-not-agents-of-change/#> >> >> >> >> -- >> www.suntoumana.blogspot.com¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To >> unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web >> interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search >> in the Gambia-L archives, go to: >> http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact >> the List Management, please send an e-mail to: >> [log in to unmask]¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ >> ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To >> unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web >> interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search >> in the Gambia-L archives, go to: >> http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact >> the List Management, please send an e-mail to: >> [log in to unmask]¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ >> ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To >> unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web >> interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search >> in the Gambia-L archives, go to: >> http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact >> the List Management, please send an e-mail to: >> [log in to unmask]¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ >> ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To >> unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web >> interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search >> in the Gambia-L archives, go to: >> http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact >> the List Management, please send an e-mail to: >> [log in to unmask]¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ >> ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To >> unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web >> interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html >> >> To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: >> http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact >> the List Management, please send an e-mail to: >> [log in to unmask]¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ >> > > > > -- > *"Be the change you want to see in the World"* > ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To > unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web > interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html > > To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: > http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the > List Management, please send an e-mail to: > [log in to unmask]¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ > ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤