Matarr:
You might as well rest your case: the reality is that scholarships to university during the Jawara regime were by and large merit driven, and there was a process in place. The reason why they cannot name one single person connected to the political class who might have benefited from the process, clearly an indication that the allegation was from attaya vous pundits. I am sure that there might have been well connected folks that maybe got scholarships to institutions seen as reputable, but without a doubt were equally qualified.
I guess the point that Sidi is really making is that most of the allegations levelled against the PPP, in regards to corruption were just that allegations, and even the APRC Govt has never been able to back up their claims against the Government of the PPP. Now, that is not to say there were no corruptions in Government departments, but to say that it was endemic and the PPP Government was in support of it or has never demonstrated a commitment to fight it, is really a stretched. Especially now that we are confronted with real corruption and abuse of office, it does not make sense to even mention perceived corruptions from the Jawara regime. It somehow gives some justification that what we have now is just a continuation of the norm, and that is far from the truth.
Thank you
Musa Jeng
Saikou
I know Sidi Sanneh knows the truth of the matter. Sidi have all the time in world to respond himself. Ministers and big players then and now hardly look the African University way.
It is shocking seeing people play around open secrets. What a joke. The catelogues of unfairness cannot even be audited. It is impossible. Sidi Sanneh knows the truth, playing politics with it is simply sad at his age and academic level.
I was reading an Oxford University lecturer quoting Sidi Sanneh yet the same man is contradicting himself with 'bring forward the proof in an endemic corrupt institution'. Lets be serious.
The South African truth and reconciliation commission is an example we need to emulate. Let us accept past wrong doings and look ahead. Failure to do that will leave us nowhere. The current situation is self evident calamity...
Thanks Suntou
¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.htmlMatar ,
There is one simple truth here,Jawara and his ministers will never send their sons or daughters to eatern Europe or Ghana to study.their money and connections were too advance for that.it was people like your uncle ,the Koro Sallah,the Bye Sallahs,the Dauda kahs,etc who will go there because it was Even free to study in these countries then A scholarship borad with a mikemosr budet will never attract the attention of the then.Jawara ministers,who spend their summer holidays in western Europe .What people were saying then,which Sidi sannhet did turn arround,was that 'they send their kids to study in western Europe " Kan you ask Sidi how many sons or daughters of the then Jawara regime who applied for schorlaship to Eastern Europe or Africa .
For freedom
Saiks
Date: Fri, 23 May 2014 12:31:59 -0700
From: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: Sidi Sanneh Says Bring the forth the Evidence
To: [log in to unmask]
¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.html To Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤Nyang, I am not the one to preach morality. You and Suntou keep saying "as far as I know" but are yet to come up with anything. As far as you know, which third parties were funding all the students to African Universities? In regards to "scope" I will ask that you read your first post when you forwarded this to the L. You and Suntou both came thinking the evidence is so easily attainable, but when asked to name one, you start drawing blanks and involved yourselves in muddying the waters. Your call for au Secours are yet to be answered; 4 days and counting, not one single name.
And yes, I am categorically stating for the record that scholarships that are for all Gambians should be opened to all Gambians regardless of status. The problem with your "matarr does not see anything wrong..." is that those scholarships did not go to the sons and daughters of the said ministers as you are insinuating, but mostly to Gambians of poorer backgrounds. So, I definitely do not see anything wrong with how the scholarships were allocated. In regards to educating one's offsprings, Jawara was one of the most equitable heads of states in Africa. Unlike his peers, some of his children attended the same public schools that the sons and daughters of farmers attended. In Africa, that is almost unheard of, as most heads of states elect to send their kids to mega rich institution abroad or at expensive international schools in their countries.
As for you and scholarships, my uncle attended Crab Island and made his way to Gambia High School before going to Russia were he pursued higher education despite the "state of the institution" he attended in his early days as a student under the P.P.P. If you did not spent hours studying at LK to have good marks that will qualify you for a scholarship, that is on you and not on Jawara. You can however keep blaming Jawara.
As for Suntou's policeman analogy, it just shows a man grasping for straws. At least I can name two police officers who were accused of taking bribes. Whether I can ascertain that they are guilty or not, is a different story but at least I have names. The difference here is, you and Suntou believe in the myth but cannot name one single person that you are saying was unjustly awarded a scholarship.
I hope your both redirect your efforts into something that is more useful than sitting here a trying to propagate a myth that you cannot prove. For the old guards, it is their duty to defend their record that has been under fire for 40 years, hence why Sidi is asking that you name him 1 person you believe unjustly received scholarship. 30 years in government with one head of state is way too long, and I can assure you that you can and will find a genuine corruption scheme that no sensible being will challenge you on. Until then, this one is not one of them.
Thanks,Matarr.
On Friday, May 23, 2014 1:35 PM, Modou Nyang <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Suntou,We will continue to see and hear from People like Sidi Sanneh as long as we continue with the current decadence in Banjul. But fortunately for us, we are now smart enough to put their wordsmithry and supposed sophistication under check. Sidi's challenge is well calculated and the motive behind it is akin to the example of the corrupt policeman you just gave.And as for the likes of Matarr, there no wonder he will want the topic be narrowed to who got a scholarship to Ibadan or to Oxford. They don't see any problem in a situation where a son of a farmer and that of a top executive or administrator, competed for a scholarship whilst the latter who have a relative or parent's associate sitting on the decision making table. for someone like I will not be surprised with them but the good thing is that none of them has a monopoly over the truth.
Burama, no, the discussion is not limited to scholarships and the assignment of responsibility of who should come up with the evidence. That narrow alley is being forced through by Matarr because as he told us, he is one of the sons of those former Jawara associates being accused of nepotism.The discourse is wide ranging as Sidi's rambling touched on political and other issues. Personally, as someone who was in junior secondary school when Jawara was booted out of office I am not one who can accuse any for denying me a scholarship. I may not have been even qualified as a result of the poor state of the schooling I went through. What significant point I pointed out is the supposed lie or attempt to play smart by Sidi where he attributed the reason for the preference of African universities to those in UK and US because of cost. I questioned the veracity of that statement because I far as I know some if not all of the students who went to those African universities were funded by third party resources and not Gambia government funds. But this Matarr is not interested because it serves to expose the fallacy in Sidi's argument.
Regards,Nyang
On Friday, May 23, 2014 11:01 AM, Burama Jammeh <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Matarr
Sorry if you think am play games. I thought am contributing to a Gambian discussion.
I pointed that if one side ask for 1 proof the other could ask for making public all scholarships issued - that is a tie.
Naming 1 person either side is not going to prove this matter one way or another. The prove will be in making the whole (scholarships issued/managed) under PPP.
Should you have the data and/or know the source - you may prove your point with evidence and prove others on the other side wrong.
My apologies if I offend your position.
Burama
On Friday, May 23, 2014, Matarr Sillah <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.htmlBurama, nice try with your games. You know quite well that what we are asking you is not "data" per say. I think you studied finance and are well aware of the statistical rule that to draw any conclusive evidence, one will need at least 30 samples. What Sidi is asking you is not data but rather making a point that the myth advanced for 40 years is untrue. The number 1 that he is requesting is not data my friend. Do you want me to give you 1 person who received government scholarship who was not the son or daughter of a minister? I can do better and give you 10 if you like but only in exchange of your one. Try this reverse psychology on someone else.
Thanks,Matarr
On Friday, May 23, 2014 10:32 AM, Burama Jammeh <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Matarr
Thanks again!
It would be helpful if share the data on this forum. Or you may reach me at [log in to unmask].
Regards
Burama
On Friday, May 23, 2014, Matarr Sillah <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Nice try Burama.
On Friday, May 23, 2014 10:08 AM, Burama Jammeh <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Matarr
I could like to see that data and/or source. I hope it includes all scholarships issued/managed by that government in its entirety.
I feel you that others shouldn't throw out accusations lightly. However the burden of proof to otherwise lies with the public office and not the individual. I'm no lawyer - we may need Mr. LJ Darbo's help.I would suggest putting forward the data to the forum and/or refer the other parties to reference it.
Looking forward to seeing that data.
Thanks
Burama
On Friday, May 23, 2014, Matarr Sillah <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Burama, yes and my data is ZERO, ZLITCH, NADA. I said no son or daughter of a government minister received scholarships to the U.S or U.K. Perception is reality to some, but that gives no one the right to say unfounded things about other peoples children just because of a grievances or two these individuals may have with the government or institution their parents were serving.
On Friday, May 23, 2014 9:38 AM, Burama Jammeh <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
Matarr
This is tie debate!
I hailed from Jambur/Badibou - I don't these ministers and/or their children. Just kidding!
I can't and I don't think the other parties to your discussion can give names because they were not issuing those scholarships. The question becomes why do they alleged as they did? The answer could be derived from perception and what obtains in other areas. They maybe right and/or wrong.
However the same can be said about your position to give prove. That is can you prove the sponsor of all the children's of miTo Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤ To unsubscribe/subscribe or view archives of postings, go to the Gambia-L Web interface at: http://listserv.icors.org/archives/gambia-l.htmlTo Search in the Gambia-L archives, go to: http://listserv.icors.org/SCRIPTS/WA-ICORS.EXE?S1=gambia-l To contact the List Management, please send an e-mail to: [log in to unmask] ¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤¤
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