Hello Bill!
No need for "please cease"pleads. We can turn this otherwise ugly dispute in
stimulating conversation - this list is made to serve this purposes.
 Your argumentation is a bit old-fashioned. Leftist sociologists, but
sociologists who are scientist in the first place, and who are not
post-modernist ( I am allergic to this trend of thought) have diffeent
opinion on racism and definitions. I am a "follower" of Boiurdieu , not just
in this matter, I regard him as probably most accomplished sociologist alive
and I suggest that you read something about racism amongst his works ( I
suspect you have read already much from him), though I am not sure in what
extent is he translatedin English.
 Modern ( non-postmodernist) sociology, in France & Germany,
neo-structuralist sociology, offers definition of "racism" category which
are now accepted in academic circles.
Respectfully,
                       Andrej



----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Bartlett <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2000 8:00 AM
Subject: Re: [CHOMSKY] FW: United States/Kosovo


> Andrej Grubacic wrote:
>
> >Yes, that was exactly what I have asked for. My english is imperfect, of
> >course, but  think that I'have been clear in my message, or kind request
,
> >that lumping "Serbs" into one category, demonized and labeled as
> >"genocidal", is something that is in sociology text books described as
> >RACISM;
>
> You are totally wrong. It is not "racism" in any sense. "Racism" is, in
> simplistic terms, discrimination based on race. "Race", in this context,
is
> a subdvision of humanity on the basis of more or less unique physical (not
> cultural) and genetically-transmitted characteristics.
>
> Serbs are not, by any stretch of the imagination, a unique "race".
Therefor
> chauvinism or discrimination against Serbs is not and never can be
referred
> to as "racism".
>
> I understand that for a brief period under the Nazis there was some
attempt
> to define Serbs (along with some other Europeans) as racially distinct in
> some vague and arbitrary way. That was racism in a misguided sense I
> suppose, but it didn't even occur to the Nazis to suppose that Serbs were
a
> unique race, distinct from other slavs. That would be a new concept
> entirely.  Unless you can point to an example of Tresy attempting to
> portray Serbs as having unique genetic characteristics which distinguish
> them from other people of European descent, then you are technically in
> error to call Tresy's comments racism.
>
> Chauvinism at worst. Because the English language is not your native
> tongue, this error is easily understood and forgiven, but you should
> understand that it is a serious error, both technically (because it is
> wrong) and rhetorically (because it is so obviously inappropriate that it
> serves only to undermine everything else you might say.) Not to mention
> that it belittles a terrible social problem, that of *actual* racism.
>
> Please cease.
>
> Bill Bartlett
> Bracknell tas