Demba, you're a funny man when you wanna be.
[From: Demba Baldeh <[log in to unmask]> To: GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Sun, Mar 11, 2012 16:59:38 -0700 Subject: Re: [G_L] Clarification On IEC
"The color of judgement of leaders of a political party anywhere in the world is only significant to the party members" Haruna.
Absolutely NOT!] Demba.
Ok Demba, I'm listening.
[Political parties are not formed for members only...] Demba.
I agree to an extent Demba. Actually, The members form and nurture a political party so they can earn the largest number of votes. And until you become one of those who becomes a member of the political party, the judgement of its leaders in entering into agreement or treaty with other political parties is not significant to Demba and it is beyond Demba's purview. If they commit a crime however, it becomes significant to Demba and Haruna.
[they are formed to win the hearts and minds of citizen electorates and other interest groups.] Demba.
Even though this is listlessly broad Demba, I will grant it to you. I want you to refine it a bit to: They are formed to earn and solicit votes from eligible voters and fellow citizens.
When you bring hearts and minds and all manner of interest groups into it, that is when you begin to wayfare. You confuse yourself and you try to do any and everything to be loved and worshiped by folk you'd rather not get close to.
[They have goals beyond their members....] Demba.
Obviously Demba. In fact it is the members who set the goals for the political party. The members nurture and grow the party so when it comes to election time, the party candidates can garner the most votes from eligible citizen voters. I still don't see Demba and Haruna in the operational decision-making of political party leaders.
[Therefore, the judgement of their leadership is significant to the people they seek to represent or govern...] Demba.
No. This is non-sequitur.
First, political parties do not seek to govern anybody. You govern yourself. What political parties seek is your vote or your brother's vote in order that they may represent your desires and wishes in government decision-making. And you cannot be there for one reason or the other, so you are yourself seeking for someone to represent you in government decision-making. Not someone to govern you.
Second, what the political party members do, who self-fund their party from their own pockets and the pockets of their sympathizers and donors, to develop their party or engage in agreements and treaties with other political parties, IS INSIGNIFICANT TO DEMBA AND HARUNA. If you want to influence those operational decisions (special interest group) of political parties, you either get them to hire your services or you become a member of the party.
Demba do you know that you can become a member of any political party and then vote for another political party????????????????? This is not a trick question.
[Any political party with this kind of ideology will remain marginalized in the eyes of the electorates...] Demba.
Demba you have a large sense of importance when it comes to electorate calculus. No matter the ideology you're talking about.
[("Not even journalists. Word!!" - Haruna) There appears to be something that bothers you about Demba's association with the word Journalist...] Demba.
Hangh?????????? Demba's association with the word Journalist????????? I think I introduced the word journalist in this here conversation, not you. And the reason I did that was because whenever I advance this theory of the INDEPENDENCE of political parties from hazardous influence peddlers, the first thing I hear is "The press and journalists have a right to this and that where ordinary citizens don't have a right". I always want to head off such cacamayme. I knew you to be a proprietor of an e-journal and I was afraid (not bothered) you may lay claim to some extraordinary power or privilege to question the decisions of leaders of political parties in the daily working of their parties. I wanted you to understand that even that does not grant you any more privilege to humbug political party leaders.
Now if the political party is funded from tax-payer contributions and you are a taxpayer, then you have all the rights to question, query, and investigate any and all decisions made by leaders of political parties. And if you happen to be a journalist who is also a taxpayer or are working for a taxpayer journal, you not only have a right to do so, you are duty-bound to do so and Haruna will be expecting you to do it and then report back to me on your findings. In all these cases, what accrued this conversation:
"Point of observation! Apparently the broad consensus was inter party something they never agreed on in the past... and not within individual parties, thus the reason individual PMs are defying their party's advice for boycott... The whole thing appears unorganized and hastily signed off on just..like.. NADD without agreement with members... Shows bad judgment in leadership again...Demba"
borders more on wayfaring slander than on any due-diligent punditry, even if you're a tax-paying pundit and the political parties are funded by tax-payers. Now do you understand what I meant when I introduced the profession of journalist????
So rest easy Demba. I admire journalists and should you desire to be a journalist, I would want you to be the best journalist there is.
[For the last time... I am a citizen first and I utter my opinion about the issues regardless of what label anyone wants to give me...] Demba.
Settle down Demba. Your citizenship and your right to freedom of expression or association for religion and industry has nothing to do with your crimes. What're you talking about???? You may be a handsome citizen but you ain't that pretty.
[What profession I choose to pursue is mine and mine only... So the sooner people learn to get use to separating my opinions with the kind of work I do the more heart ache they can save themselves...] Demba.
You wouldn't get any argument from me on this. In fact I'm on your side in that campaign. Demba you're talking to Haruna. Get off this conflict of interest thing. That's not what we're talking about here. Did you remember when we had that conversation here a year or two ago? I stood up for and stand up for even conflict of interest punditry. What I have always cautioned against is the commission of crimes while relying on Freedom of speech and association rights. And I always reminded all in the journalism bidniss that they more than any other professional, should pay a greater attention to this, if ambiguous line. So let's focus on the issue at hand. And refer to your statement that got us here.
[I shall opine on any issue I see fit and am not out to impress anyone..] Demba.
Demba, if you tell me one more time that you have a right to opine, I'll wring your small neck. You need to lay off whatever it is that you're on Men. What're you talking about???
Haruna. We still love you you know?
-----Original Message-----
From: Haruna <[log in to unmask]>
To: GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Sun, Mar 11, 2012 6:30 pm
Subject: Re: [G_L] Clarification On IEC
Demba,
The color of judgement of leaders of a political party anywhere in the world is only significant to the party members. I would engage myself otherwise if I were you. Or form your own party and practice your leadership skills. Even then, your leadership qualities will be beyond my purview unless I decide to join your party.
So unless the political parties are funded and nurtured by taxpayer funds, no Gambian who is NOT a member of a political party, has any business qualifying the leadership qualities of party members. Not even journalists. Word!! That is highly subjective and gets ever close to committing libel and slander against your fellow man/woman.
Haruna. I encourage you bear on greater sobriety.
-----Original Message-----
From: Demba Baldeh <[log in to unmask]>
To: GAMBIA-L <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Sun, Mar 11, 2012 4:34 pm
Subject: Re: [G_L] Clarification On IEC
Point of observation! Apparently the broad consensus was inter party something they never agreed on in the past... and not within individual parties, thus the reason individual PMs are defying their party's advice for boycott...
The whole thing appears unorganized and hastily signed off on just..like.. NADD without agreement with members... Shows bad judgment in leadership again...
Demba
Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
From: UDP United Kingdom <[log in to unmask]>
Sender: The Gambia and Related Issues Mailing List <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2012 17:35:40 +0000
To: <[log in to unmask]>
ReplyTo: The Gambia and Related Issues Mailing List <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: [G_L] Clarification On IEC
Kebbeh, the initiative came up while darboe was abroad and upon his return he went there and took charge as expected of a leader of the biggest opposition. We've always look for a broad consensus on issues like boycott because that is the only way they can yeild dividend. Thus, when we saw an opportunity, we grapped it. If there was no broad consensus, udp would have contested notwithstanding the flaws of our electoral system.
I leave you to wallow in your muddy waters of lying beast.
Get a life.
Daffeh
On Sunday, 11 March 2012, C. Omar Kebbeh <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Daffeh,
> Please be serious and admit the truth. Only crazy folks will compare UDP to PDOIS. Even folks on this forum who are just scared to reveal the truth know that UDP is a failed party. Why would Darbo of all people leave his cozy chamber and go to the crowded peoples center to sign a boycott with folks he never agreed with during the presidential elections. The only answer I have is that the UDP is desperate and know that they will not do well in the parliamentary elections.
> Looking at the bigger picture, PDOIS we all know served Gambians since the 1980's and UDP is a one man show. A classic example is the recent presidential elections. Even though PDOIS is an older party than NRP, and probably have more resources than NRP, the gentlemen at the PDOIS rallied behind Hamat after the peoples congress nominated him as the flag bearer. Sidia and Hamat, did not say "we have been in politics for longer or our ideologies are different from Hamat", they supported him throughout the process. That is what you call real gentlemen. And remember too that both have been presdential candidates without a feud.
> Darbo on the other hand will never let anyone be UDP leader because he is the party and the party is him. Folks here will not tell you the truth because they are all afraid. Recall how many coalitions UDP had, UDP-NDAM, UDP-NRP, UDP-GMC, and in non of those coalition will darbo allow any to be heard. All you hear is UDP is the biggest party. Well if you are the biggest party why do you have to go to the people center to beg the gentlemen to boycott the elections.
> Recently, there has been a number of posts on how the current situation in Senegal may spill over to the Gambia. Well, for folks who think that, my advice is that it will never happen as long as Darbo is in front of UDP. Could you guys imagine a situation where Hamat Bah is Macky Sall and Darbo is Mustapha Nyiasse. Who in their right mind would think that Darbo will rally behind Hamat like Nyiasse may do for Mr. Sall to remove Babili Mansa in a second round. He will still continue to insist that UDP is the biggest party and the most popular.
> In fact, this has been manifested by him several times. Just like the past elections, many of us here were equally frustrated by Darbo in 2001 and 2006....
> On Sun, Mar 11, 2012 at 12:34 PM, UDP United Kingdom <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> Aaaah! You got the hum already, nyan. I won't blame you for that is a real virtue of being insulate. You appreciate nothing other than the fatwa/summons from the top clergy.
>>
>> And by the way could you advice if your Ayatollah is adding more names to the list of people who aren't suppose to attend his funeral when he dies?
>>
>> Daffeh
>>
>> On Sunday, 11 March 2012, Modou Nyang <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> > I think you better consentrate on dealing with Kebbeh. I do not have time for your nonsense.
>> >
>> > From: UDP United Kingdom <[log in to unmask]>
>> > To: [log in to unmask]
>> > Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 9:55 AM
>> > Subject: Re: [G_L] Clarification On IEC
>> >
>> > Nyan you will agree with me that the period leading to the 1996 elections was a period of anormaly. An old order was toppled and a new republic was taking shape. Thus, everything political was starting afresh with the creation of the piec which was hitherto non-existence. But for the purpose of avoiding triviality, let me state that ' pdois never ceased to exist politically and legaLly since its registration in 1996' and that both halifa and sidia had once resigned from it inorder to serve or become candidates of nadd. That is something you probably need to advice kebbeh on since you always put out yourself as more pdois than Ayatollah sallah.
>> >
>> > Daffeh
>> >
>> > On Sunday, 11 March 2012, UDP United Kingdom <[log in to unmask]> wrot Kebbeh, as far as I know, pdois never ceased to exist both legally and politically since their inception in the 1980s. Even when part of nadd, they still exists as a seperate legal entity and soveriegn party. Halifa has emphasised this point over and overand rightly so.Therefore,I don't know what you filled your head with when you said in reference to pdois and nrp ' remember in both cases the entire party cease to exist.'
>> >>
>> >> Should you insist with your line, I will advice that you state clearly to the readership when pdois de-registered and when re-registered with the IEC and hopefully you will get help from the likes of modou nyang, malik kah and pa samba jow.
>> >>
>> >> Udp never sought to prevent anybody from contesting the NA polls. All we said to our potential candidates is that the party is not particpating and therefore would not be sponsoring any candidate. Therefore, if a sitting member wants to participate as an independent, he would have to resign by virtue of section 91 of the constitution inorder to be able to do so just like how hamat resigned from nrp to contest independent or how halifa and sedia both resigned from pdois inorder to become candidates of nadd.
>> >>
>> >> Get a life, my friend.
>> >>
>> >> Daffeh
>> >>
>> >> On Saturday, 10 March 2012, C. Omar Kebbeh <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Daffeh, don't insult our intelligence... The issue here and that of hamat and halifa are quite distinct.... In the case of hamat and halifa, their entire party decided to join a coalition and they had to, by our election laws, resign from their parties. Remember, in both cases the entire party cease to exist. Halifa did not resign from pdois and sedia remain and congested. They all joined with their entire resources.
>> >>>
>> >>> Mr. Daffeh is either interestwd in his own pocket or does not agree with UDP's ideologies - the decision by darbo not to contest the elections. In the same context, I guess it will be ok if all your former candidates including peters, nyassi, and others decide to go independent. In that case what is the essence of the boycott. It means that you still believe in the election process; that you disagree with darbo's decision that the election cannot be free and fair.
>> >>> I think this is the beginning of the end of UDP. I wouldn't be surprised if more UDP candidates quit UDP and contest as independent - marking the end of the party.
>> >>> The difference between pdois and UDP is that UDP is in to get the presidency through the back door. Darbo came in in 19996 thinking because he was feted during his first rally in brikama that he will sweep the polls. Pdois has been fighting for Gambias since the 80s. Even though sedia is holding a seat in parliament, he will not abandon pdois; if he does, I will buy you, Bamba, and Suntu a latte.... Sedia, like halifa, is a gentleman and will continue to stand for th
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